Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.) "would have to know much much more" about Iran’s internationally disputed nuclear program before deciding what to do about it.
Asked by Bill O’Reilly last evening if he would contemplate "action to stop the Iranians from developing a nuclear weapon," Ellison responded, "no, I wouldn’t."
Ellison mistakenly argued that the United Nations inspectors are in Iran (they were kicked out) and that the U.S. has satellites capable of spying on Iran’s deeply burrowed underground nuclear sites.
O’REILLY: Joining us is Congressman Keith Ellison from Minnesota. If sanctions fail would you support military action to stop the Iranians from developing a nuclear weapon?
ELLISON: No, I wouldn’t. I would have to know much much more than that at this point, Bill, what we know now is that neither Israeli or American military experts have come to the conclusion that Iran has decided to build a bomb. Then their conclusion is that if and when that conclusion is arrived at by Iranian’s leadership it will take a year to develop one. Then take years to come up with delivery system.
I’m not on your show saying I’m going to authorize military action. There is a long ways before that we need diplomacy.
O’REILLY: They are trying obviously, everybody is trying diplomacy. They are never going to get and you know this conclusive evidence on either side about what the Iranians are doing. They do it in secret. Far underground. Israelis believe that they are very close to having some kind of nuclear weapon that they don’t necessary solid to put on a missile but they can put in a suitcase and put it in Tel Aviv. So, I know what you are saying but it’s a risky proposition to start military action when you can’t convince the American people like WMDs were in Iraq.
We said they were there and we went and we couldn’t find them. There is going to be that mind set of you better show me. It’s going to be impossible to show anybody. If they do develop the nuclear weapon, congressman, as you know it’s too late.
ELLISON: Well, let me tell you this. The fact is is that inspections are going on.
O’REILLY: No. They have barred most of the—they have barred the key inspections as you know and they went over there two weeks ago the U.N. inspectors and the Iranians said you can’t go in over there exactly what Saddam Hussein did. Let him come into the country you can go there but not come here. They don’t have unfettered access you know that.
ELLISON: Here is what I do know that Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff have said that war with Iran would be destabilizing. He said that there is no.
O’REILLY: Of course it would be.
ELLISON: It would be far worse—it would be far worse than allowing diplomacy to move forward. We have had about a sum total of about 45 minutes. Of about 45 minutes.
O’REILLY: Let me ask.
ELLISON: 45 minutes of diplomacy in the last 40 years, Bill.
O’REILLY: That’s on your dime with Barack Obama. If you don’t think diplomacy has been there. He has had three years. It’s on your president. Not your president but my president, too. I’m not here to debate that issue. Is it more dangerous for the Iranians to have a nuclear weapon, all right? Or for the world to be destabilized which I agree with you and General Dempsey would happen if the were military action against Iran? Which is more dangerous Iran having a nuke or destabilization i think it’s more destabilizing to have a catastrophic war across the Middle East.
ELLISON: I think it’s more dangerous to have a destabilizing war that will spill out across the middle east
O’REILLY: That’s what I thought you were going to say you are honest man that’s why you are here. You would be willing to trade no military action and we will try to contain Iran when they get the nuclear bomb or nuclear device.
ELLISON: You are already downtown block and we haven’t stepped out of the house.
You are already down the block and we haven’t stepped out of the house.
O’REILLY: We absolutely have stepped out of the house. They have the scientists working on them. The uranium in place. They won’t let the U.N. inspectors in to see what they are doing. Come on.
ELLISON: Invite Martin Dempsy on your show. You will learn different from what you just said fact of the matter is.
O’REILLY: Martin Dempsy has not said anything like that.
ELLISON: They don’t have a weapon. They haven’t made a decision to do one.
O’REILLY: How would you know they made a decision to not do one? How would you know that?
ELLISON: I’m glad you asked. we have satellite technology. We have technology.
O’REILLY: They are underground. The satellites can’t penetrate the earth. They are underground. We have inspectors going on. They won’t let them go in. They haven’t. They went two weeks ago and they wouldn’t let them go in.
ELLISON: I’m sorry, I’m not going to base a war on a maybe. 4,409 Americans are dead because somebody—
O’REILLY: The reason we like you as a guest is because you are an honest man. I will point to history the same mind set was taken when dealing with Nazi, Germany. We don’t believe they are going to do this and do that and they absolutely did everything.
ELLISON: I have got to tell you in World War II, they attacked Pearl Harbor, that would be enough.
O’REILLY: No, this is the German theater not the Japanese.
ELLISON: I’m just telling you you are bringing up the World War II conflict.
Our leaders there took the lives of American servicemen and women so seriously that they didn’t rest on a gamble. And that’s the kind of leadership that I hope to be.
O’REILLY: Now instead of a pearl harbor attack and a nuke attack and that’s a whole different deal. Congressman, always good to debated with you. Thank you.
ELLISON: Thank you.